Ben Lampron, author of Jumpstart Your Future joins JJ and Melissa to talk about how young adults are not often aware personal finance, relationship building, and career development focuses. Ben highlights lessons learned, offers practical tips and tools, and teaches how self awareness for young people can make a massive difference in their ability to stand out from 'everybody else' and get ahead in their own lives.
Melissa Albers 0:00
Hey everyone, you are listening to the self awareness journey podcast. This little bander is about a car ride long and features your hosts, JJ Parker. And Melissa Albers. JJ owns a tech company. And Melissa has been a coach working with influencers for the last 18 years. When I was 21 years old, I was excited because I got a credit card invitation in the mail. And I didn't really know much about credit cards at 21. So I thought what could go wrong? It was a Discover card. And at the time, you could go to a Sears store. I'm so do yourself. Yeah. And you could take out cash from this card.
JJ Parker 0:50
Well, this sounds like a very magical, like thing for us. It's a good one year old. Yeah,
Melissa Albers 0:57
yeah. So I went to Sears and I took out several $1,000, I maxed out the card, actually. And I took that cash. And I went to Florida with my best friend and roommate, Karen.
JJ Parker 1:13
That sounds like super good financial decisions are young adults. Exactly. So why did you do that? Like, did you not understand the mechanisms like how credit cards work, you just thought like, Hey, this is cool. This thing I show on this piece of plastic and cash goes in my pocket.
Melissa Albers 1:30
Yes. And I can do whatever I want without any consequence. So as we've always talked about maturing over the years, and I've done the best that I can with what I had to work with, I really got in a lot of credit trouble. Like I had really bad credit for about two years, or maybe even three or four years. I can't remember. But being young, oh my gosh, I was not aware of the consequences of my behaviors. So
JJ Parker 1:58
that's not like a real great way to start out your young adult life right now. I just been, you know, not really understanding how the world works, being saddled with a bunch of credit card debt and kind of getting off on the wrong foot. Exactly.
Melissa Albers 2:14
JJ Parker 2:15
we have a very special guest with us today.
Melissa Albers 2:20
That very subject. Welcome Ben lamb pride. In
JJ Parker 2:23
fact, he's our first guest. Yeah. So Ben wrote a book called jumpstart your future.
Ben Lampron 2:33
Yes, JJ. Good morning, Melissa. Hi.
Melissa Albers 2:36
Hi. Hi. We are really excited actually to have some conversation about Ben's topic, because we've been talking about having a guest on for a long time. And Ben just released his book. It was released on April 6, April 6, April 6. And there's so many good things to talk about in here. We just thought it'd be fun to have you on this morning. And, and and talk about some of the topics of this book.
Ben Lampron 3:05
Yeah, I'm really thrilled to be here, Melissa, you know, the book was written with young people in mind. Through my career, in my personal life, I have a lot of impact and connection with young folks. And they're just thirsty for knowledge. So I took the things I've learned in my career and put them in a book, and I'm really excited to share them.
Melissa Albers 3:23
That's awesome. And I have read the book. And I've I was saying, boy, this book would have been really helpful for me. Had I been 21 when you wrote this book?
JJ Parker 3:37
Can you just give us like an overview? Like what generally what is? What is jumpstart your future? What is this about?
Ben Lampron 3:45
Yeah, sure. So so when I think about the book, JJ, I want to take what's kind of in my head and the lessons I've learned throughout my personal and professional life, and be able to help the folks that are graduating now have that information and data today, so they don't have to learn through the school of hard knocks and, and learn over the years. They can put those things into play. Immediately. I cover everything from personal finance, relationship building. We'll talk about career development. And I think those first few years of someone's career from let's say, age 22 to age 30, are so critical in terms of building the base in those three areas. I think being able to share those lessons now so that you someone in 22, and not find out when they're 30, I think is just a huge boost to their life.
JJ Parker 4:32
So Melissa, shared one of her hard knock stories. And you just alluded to maybe you have a few in the book. You want to share one with us. Well, what was one of the lessons you learned as a young person?
Ben Lampron 4:48
Sure. Isn't kind of interesting story. But one one activity I did uj early in my life is I was a boxer. So through college, I followed in my father's footsteps. He was a world Well known trainer and a boxer himself. So I decided to give this sport a chance. And I was pretty successful by train hard, won quite a few fights. But really what happened at the end of my career was really tough for me today to even consider as I was sparring in one of my training sessions, a kid beat me up pretty good. And I wasn't really ready for the night. And that took quite a few shots. And literally in the middle of around, I stopped fighting. And I walked out of the ring, forever, in the middle of around in the middle of his training session, in the middle of a whole night of training. And, frankly, that's carried with me for years, in terms of one of life's lessons, that you can't end things that way. My father didn't deserve that I didn't deserve that the sport didn't deserve it. If I could go back and do that tonight, one more time, I would finish the round, I would finish the night. And, you know, if that's the way I had to learn that lesson, while I learned it, but you know what, JJ? and Melissa, you have to finish what you start, you have to carry the ball to the end. And no, I never let that happen again. So it was really a strong lesson for me in terms of my just my personal and my professional life.
JJ Parker 6:08
That super interested in like, this idea that you know, that your, that you as an adult are carrying with you? I don't know, maybe you want to call that regret, or at least you're carrying with you a motion that happened to you? A long time ago, right? So this idea that some of your choices as a young person might really affect you emotionally, for your entire life.
Melissa Albers 6:37
Yeah, and what I what I was just thinking, as you were talking, Ben is, I think at that age, there's so much emotion that we think is more immediate, you know, like, we don't have the awareness to see how something can happen. And depending how we handle it in that moment, we don't have the awareness to understand that it will carry on for so much longer. And it's it's such an impactful story. Because it can happen with something like a sport like you're talking about, it can happen with a relationship, it can happen with your interaction with a teacher. I mean, it could just there's so many places where that could happen.
Ben Lampron 7:19
Yeah, and so some of those moments that are just, they're so short, are so fleeting, that you don't really know you don't realize the impact at the time. And as I got older and older, that that really, really bothered me. And that's the point where I'm still trying to make it right. So I trained today, and I'm trying trying to make that that memory, a better one. But you know, at the end of the day, sometimes we're hardest on ourselves and anyone else's. Did anyone else in the gym that night remember that story? Probably not. But certainly had an impact on me. both good and bad.
Unknown Speaker 7:49
Melissa Albers 7:50
What do you think is? If you were to put that in a capsule, what would you say was your biggest thing that you learned from that experience in that? Because you've told that story in your book that you hope other people will take from that?
Ben Lampron 8:05
Yeah, and it's actually Jay mentioned the word regret, I think the section of the book is called regrets. You know, you're going to have them. There's no question that we're going to do things in our lives that we wish we could do differently. I think you have to turn that into a positive. And what I've tried to do, Melissa, throughout my life is there have been specific times where I've wanted to jump ship or stop or bail or whatever. And I just haven't I plowed through, I get to the end, because I don't want to have that happen again. So, you know, I learned from it. And I think it's a real positive in my life.
Melissa Albers 8:37
You know, if I could interject a little piece right here, I have had a lot of experience with coaching and with therapy and things like that over the years. And if there are people listening to this podcast that have had something happen to them in their lives in which it was a very impactful, quick, something that happened. And they've regretted that one of the really cool things that you can do is what you what you call reframing, where you actually picture yourself in as an adult, going to that person that you were at that age as though it's the two of you having a conversation or in that experience. And being an adult and reframing what that person could do in that moment. It sounds crazy, but it's a super interesting way of being able to tell the story differently and what you would do differently as though you're coaching someone else, and then be so happy and hug that young person and say that you understand. That's a really impactful thing I've seen that have really amazing impact on people. So if there are people listening that this is a great topic, this chapter of regrets is a really interesting topic and thank you for talking about that. Then talk about some of the financial pieces like how does being aware when you're younger How do you think that that can change people's focus as they look at finances?
Ben Lampron 10:06
Mr. Melissa, I think that when people are coming out of college, or out of high school into the workplace, and they get that first big check right to them, it looks really, really significant. And it's really, really exciting. To some that might say, well, there's more money I've ever thought I would ever have. Some, I feel like wow, how am I going to make ends meet? Either way, I think being self aware of where you are in the moment is critical that determines how you allocate those funds. It really where am I? What am I debt load? What does my investment strategy look like? Where do I want to be in 510 years? Do I have a family, really taking an honest inventory of where they are today, and where they might want to be in the future? I think just being aware of that situation, gives you authority and in power over your over yourself and over the situation. So I think in my book, I talk a lot about just kind of taking stock. Really being honest with myself of where where I am, I get here, don't judge myself, I am where I am. And then really, really say, hey, it's a starting point, today is the first day of the rest of my financial life. And I can take real clear, concise steps to make things better. So I think that's kind of a thing that folks have to do. Get the quiet room assessment really fixed up?
Melissa Albers 11:20
I think you have to on your website at Ben lamp run.com. I think you have some tools, right? Like some easy spreadsheets or easy ways to take some inventory.
Ben Lampron 11:33
Right, right, Melissa, I mean, I'm 48. Now, think about that. Ever since I was young, I've used the exact same tools. So it doesn't have to be complicated. It doesn't have to be any more complex, from young to older. It's a simple math, money in mind, if money out equals no surplus or deficit and what the case may be. So I really believe in just being honest with yourself and being really diligent, day after day, week, after week, month after month, understanding where your dollars are going, understanding what you've done with them and what you can do in the future. Having that sort of discipline is really the number one key to financial health, in my estimation.
JJ Parker 12:11
So that I got a question for you. So like, this book, the book, right, and your desire to coach young people and make some of his more like pragmatic financial decisions and understand how their actions affect their future and everything. My first thought is like, there's going to be, like a part us chunk of the young people who actually think in this way, right? Like, they actually are a little bit like, okay, yeah, I gotta probably figure figure it out. Right. And they might seek a resource, like your book, which has got tons of tips. And my question to you is, like, how are you reaching? The the young people that aren't really that motivated or self aware that they should be thinking about these things?
Ben Lampron 13:04
Yeah, I mean, I think there's too many types of people. But if you want to split them between the folks that are immediately interested or not, I really tried in the book to put some anecdotes and personal life stories that share how that might impact them. If you write a book with a bunch of, you know, equations or techniques or approaches, it might be boring and might not want to catch their attention. But I really try to drive on real life experiences, and how they impact those individual topics. You know, JJ, I kind of think of a couple of areas where I've really seen this in action. Through my life, I've been a coach in a lot of youth athletics, and remain involved today with with a few teams. So I have a lot of contact with some young folks there, and the mentoring I do at work. There are folks right out of school that I deal with on a daily basis. And I think I've really tried to connect with them on a personal level to understand what drives them, what what's, what's their emotional currency, and try to relate the stories to them in a way that resonates with them. Everyone is different. Everyone's coming from a different set of backgrounds from a different socio economic category. So I think one one size does not fit all, in terms of by sharing this knowledge.
JJ Parker 14:13
Yeah, when sometimes when I even reflect back on my younger self, it, I didn't have that much self awareness. I just felt like I was just like, I was just making decisions and going without really stopping and thinking much, right. And, you know, for some people that works out accidentally, like I, you know, I on thoughtfully started a company 19 and here we are probably good that I was fairly self aware because I didn't know how stupid we were being but, but others that it does cause some permanent, you know, life challenges, right? Well, JJ, I
Ben Lampron 14:53
think between the ages of 22 and 30 like me, that is a just a huge time of life. You mentioned you Kind of icebergs that people can hit and really set themselves back. But But even if that's not the case, if they just live the normal, you know, non eventful life until they're 30, that eight years, financially and professionally in terms of career development, you can never get those back and it just multiplies over the next decade. So I think hitting the ground running right out of school, or even beforehand, I mean, you should, I can't get these lessons all the time. But they're also a good start, you know, kind of before they graduated, but, you know, be ready to go into huge things. You don't waste those years. Because, as you know, when money career time is what matters.
JJ Parker 15:36
We should have in a future podcast episode where we have like, you know, your guys's kids on and I just asked him, like, what's it like to be like the daughter of a coach?
Ben Lampron 15:51
We'll make sure this is Well, I mean, I have three, I have three children, and they're all completely different. They've all taken to this book, and the information is completely different ways. So you know, it's kind of just a microcosm of society in general. Yeah.
Melissa Albers 16:03
You know what I don't get
JJ Parker 16:04
Oh, go ahead. Oh, sorry. I got one other thing that I thought was really interesting. Oh, go
Unknown Speaker 16:08
Unknown Speaker 16:09
JJ Parker 16:09
I'm just gonna jump right in, because I was kind of excited about it. So you state that, like an observation you've made of young people today, that they're more homogeneous than before. And I thought that was like a really interesting way. And what you're meaning by that is like, they watch the same stuff, they follow the same people on social media, they talk the same, and they're, they're becoming like, clones of each other or something. They're all acting in a very similar way. And there's maybe fewer outliers to that very mainstream. Thank you talk more about that. Because I thought that is really interesting.
Ben Lampron 16:58
It's really kind of counterintuitive. You think about even in schools today that the amount of offerings they have in terms of classes and activities and clubs, way more than when I was a student, and the access to information online. You guys know about that. But just a lot of data and bad, quick, easy. So you think that that would give you a bunch of different types of perspectives. But what I'm seeing is that because everyone is so connected, and everyone is literally can talk to anybody in the world at any one time, you don't even have regional differences anymore. People come in from Texas, or California or Maine that used to have their own, even dialects, frankly, that's kind of going away. And I feel like every time we meet new folks, their resumes look the same. They're there, their presentation of their background is the same experiences almost sound the same. So I feel like that people coming out of college need to find a way to break away from that, because the homogenous nature of their story is very, very interesting. I think they're they're being impacted by what you said, Jay did the same social media channels, the same folks, the same influencers? It's a phenomenon that I probably recognize that six months ago, I keep testing it. And it certainly seems to be a thing in 2021.
Melissa Albers 18:06
What I think is fascinating about your perspective here is the world is not talking like that the world is trying to microcosm groups, and more and more into subcategories. Diversity and Inclusion is a huge thing right now. And yet your idea is interesting, because what you're not saying that these groups are not diverse, what you're saying is they're they think the same way. So they may have different, they may have different focuses, or they may have different idols, or they may have different things like that, but that they're all operating in this groupthink mentality. And I find that a very fascinating thing to be thinking about.
JJ Parker 18:46
That's a different Yeah, there's the thing is, it's in one way. When we think of diversity, like a lot of times we're putting like up almost like physical or superficial, like label is like, Where are you from? A like, what color is your skin, like that kind of stuff. But we're not talking about like, diversity in like diversity of thought, right? diversity of ways of looking at the world, even right. Now, what we are saying is like, hey, that the way people are thinking is becoming very similar to each other. So there's actually less diversity in thinking, Well, you know, JJ,
Ben Lampron 19:28
here's a small example. Think about when we were back in school, I would go to the local library in my hometown and pick up an encyclopedia and research topics. Right? It's an old school of thought. But because I did that in my town, in my in my bookshelf, just the the data I was getting was different. The way it was presented to me was different in the library and or my teacher, they were coming from a different background. today. Literally, everyone's going to Wikipedia or whatever the www dot whatever, and they're getting the same information from the same source. It's really making everything the same. Very Vanilla. And when folks are in Halifax expressing themselves, you know, we had to like, communicate, make a telephone call and those sorts of things. Today it's a, it's 120 character tweet, or something on Facebook, whatever, and even look at the words people are using online to communicate, those are all the same. So I just I think it's very, very interesting that we're getting a lot of similarities in our candidates. And a lot of the thought process of the people I meet are very, very similar. So I think it's, in some ways, a challenge, but in other ways, it really allows folks who can differentiate themselves and bring a different thought process to the table to really set themselves apart. So you know, there's good and bad here.
JJ Parker 20:38
Yeah, from from a self awareness perspective, I think that's really interesting, because there is like a human need to fit in and be part of the tribe. Right? Yeah. Now, that that certainly worked great from like a survival perspective, living in the woods, right. But when, with all of the connection, when our tribe basically becomes like, the entire planet, that starts to make less sense, right? As a social interaction, and, and thanks. So I, it does take like, self awareness, and, and certainly recognizing it, and then developing a confidence to say, you know, what, I'm not gonna be like the tribe, I'm going to be different. I'm going to explore things that are different. Because I know that long term is probably better for me, right? But when you're young person in your like, day to day just trying to get your needs met, it's probably very easy to just slip into the tribe.
Ben Lampron 21:44
Yeah, I think, JJ, one thing from this is not a side topic. When you think about professional development of kids coming out of high school, I even think to high school, his approaches are very similar, and is kind of a one recipe, you got to go to a four year school, you got to get like, a professional life, where there's tons of opportunity for trade schools, for manufacturing jobs, right at high school. Now, not not everything fits every kid. And I think our schools could do a better job with that. So you're drilled your whole life that you got to get a great fit score, you got to go to a four year college, you kind of start thinking the same way. And I don't think that's fair to our kids. And I think it's setting them up for failure.
JJ Parker 22:21
I've always been really curious about this. I wanted to know your perspective on it is that I've been observing some of my friends who've got kids that are in high school, and now you know, my kids are starting to get into high school. And it seems like there's more like the timeline for like picking what college you're going to. And that's kind of like picking what career path you want is, is that younger and younger? Right? Arts
Melissa Albers 22:46
in ninth grade now.
JJ Parker 22:48
That's crazy. Oh, yeah. My ninth grader, I better, I better God telling me better figure it out. But I like I literally didn't know what college I was going to until like, I don't know, my last three weeks in my senior career now, like, I'm not a good student. And now, like, maybe that was like, that's very bad. But I'm always like, how can you expect us 16 or 17 year old to pick what their whole career might be? Yeah, at that age, they have such a narrow worldview. Right. You
Melissa Albers 23:19
know what I want to I want to interject in this because I am so with you on this. My husband is a biology professor at a college. When he was 16 years old. The guidance counselor at his high school told him you're not very smart. You should go to a trade school. That's what I said. You're not
JJ Parker 23:40
very I don't I'm not laughing. This is such a ridiculous thing to say.
Melissa Albers 23:43
Exactly. Right. Exactly. Right. There's so many things wrong with that statement. It makes trade school seem bad. It makes it sound like it's a it's a secondary thing. And trade schools actually can produce some of the highest paid people in America today. You know, and people that are creative and interesting. And yeah, so I'm, I'm so with you on that I'm so with you on that. The other thing I think that it does is it discourages children from exploring their own creativity. it discourages children to to feel confident and feel supported by the system, air quotes to be something other than this little targeted thing that high schools are trying to prove themselves by sending people to
Ben Lampron 24:37
Yeah, you know, Melissa, one thing I didn't write about in the book had to cut off somewhere, but I wanted to put a whole chapter around searching for colleges. You think about the economic disaster that a lot of kids end up where they when they go to a $70,000 a year school to study some degree that doesn't really get them a good job at the end. That's a huge, huge mistake. And I think that if you don't know what you want to do with your career Going through a two year Community College to figure it out or going to a trade school are absolutely viable options. Not only economically, but just kind of emotionally. And I think, you know, kids and parents being self aware to help talk about where my student is, in their life is just a huge, huge thing. And I think guidance counselors in high school is to do a better job there too. I mean, let's take each individual passions and where they are, and what can they afford, and put them on a spot where they can succeed.
JJ Parker 25:27
Let's talk about the parents. Well,
Melissa Albers 25:33
I feel anxious.
JJ Parker 25:36
Now your kids are, you know, they're this, this is for me? Well, when we're talking about, you know, I, I'm kind of making an assumption, but like, a lot of our listeners are probably more on the like, I have kids this age, instead of I am a kid, graduating high school. You're a high school kid listening to our podcast, hit us up on Facebook, we'd love to know. But this idea that like, Okay, we've got, like, we want the best for our kids, right? We want them to be successful adults who want to help them transition through these periods of their life. But and as an adult, though, as a parent, I might have like a lot of anxiety, a lot of worry, like, are they making the right choices? We're making a big investment in college, like, what advice do you actually have, as a parent to really recognize like, that anxiety and those feelings that might be coming up and how you might be? Not intentionally, but like applying some of that to these young, young adults?
Ben Lampron 26:44
Yeah, judge you the lesson I learned and this was really late. Actually, I probably didn't realize this until my oldest kid was a sophomore in high school or so. But I have three of them three children, and they're all going to find their own path. You know, I had this dream that they would all be, you know, high school basketball stars and Nick happen, whatever in this and they like basically my life, right. And that's, that's not the way things go. Now they enjoy basketball, I enjoyed coaching them. But you know, my oldest found their way in politics. My middle son is really into cars. And you know, my youngest daughter is in dance. I didn't pick any of those things. But they've all enjoyed success in their own way. And I think we as precious as parents had to take the pressure off ourselves, that they're going to be X, Y, or Z, just let them develop, let them find their own way to their own human beings. And the other thing that I read this in a book somewhere, and once I started using it really, really mattered, you just have to listen. All the kids want us to be in a room with them, and be aware and have your antenna up, because they might just want you to sit there with them. They might just want you to hear what they're talking about their day, they might ignore you for a week. But boy, when they start talking, you guys as a parent have to be there for them. Yeah, that's the biggest gift we can give our kids. It isn't about getting into the right school or getting to be the captain of the basketball team. It's about being their their social backstop, and being their mentor in that way. And once I figured that out, I felt a lot better to you as a parent, and I think I was able to talk to my kids in a much stronger way.
Melissa Albers 28:08
I would advice it is it's absolutely fantastic. I'd also like to plus one what you just said, Ben, when my children were in high school, and I was having a lot of anxiety about the stuff that was going on for them in school, there was you know, there were a lot of there were drug opportunities, there were the popularity issues, all of these things. And I had a very good girlfriend of mine, who was a few years ahead of me in the parenting experience. And she said something to me that I've never forgotten. She said, by the time your kids are early teens, your parenting is over. You've already taught them everything they're going to learn from you. What your job now is, is to stay consistent and be there. And I was really shocked by that. And what I have learned is not only was she right, but by the time they're 15 or 16 years old, they stop listening to you for social cues and personal cues. So you've given them this base, whatever it is. And now when they're choosing decisions, they are using their peer group, they're using their peer group and their base to make choices every single day. Not you're in you know, your influence. changing their thoughts isn't happening much anymore by that time. And understand it. Yeah. And I, that has helped me many, many times because when my kids start to do something, even today as early 20 somethings if they start to do something, I find myself like kind of wanting to jump into that parenting seat and I can feel in my body that awareness kicking over like oh, they're just I just want to you know, stop that and, and I try to every single time stop myself and just okay, yep, okay, well, you know, ask a couple questions, but they're going to make the choices that they are going to make, you know, overly responsible
Ben Lampron 30:00
My parents used to always tell me this kind of analogy that they Your parents are supposed to give your kids roots. And eventually they take off with their own wings. Right? And, and I think parenting even over the past 20 years has become more basic. And frankly, I mean, my parents, I mean, when I was 1415, I was kind of on my own. They let me go to school and let me do my own thing. They weren't hovering over me, right? They weren't posting on Facebook every single day on a test. So I think I'm just as guilty of celebrating my kids as anybody but but I think that we need to take a step back and let our kids blossom on their own. I think that's a lesson I learned along the way.
JJ Parker 30:38
Yeah. Well, this has been super fun conversation, we're like, we're pretty much out of time. That was about the fastest feeling podcast, we've done.
Melissa Albers 30:48
I have to ask one. Question. I have to ask one closing one more thing, one closing question, then, as you've written this book, and you have hoped to offer guidance and support to young people as they're starting in the world, and offering them some self awareness tips and how to understand creating their own value. How do you think that that value helps the world? In your own perspective? What's the bridge? What's the point of them doing this stuff as it relates to their, their adult life?
Ben Lampron 31:24
Normally, it took me till age 40 or so to get to the point where I provided that value. That was very self centered. You're trying to develop myself, find my way, create the future for myself. And I didn't really have all the tools, I had to kind of figure it out along the way. I think we're all intrinsically valuable, we want to be valuable, we want to have impact on folks. But we're so busy with our noisy heads and our busy schedules to allow that human nature to come out. I think that the things in this book, if you can kind of formulate a plan, get yourself to a stable place earlier than 40, let's say 30 or 25, that the more quickly you can become that person in the world that wait for others to look up to. It really isn't about you. You really need to stop being so focused on yourself. So self centered, and say, You know what, I have a lot to offer. And I'm now stable enough. I can do that. So to me, it's all about time more. So the quicker we can get to a place where we're comfortable and stable as adults. The earlier we can be a mentor to others, including young folks. So I think that's kind of the bridge. That's great.
JJ Parker 32:29
So the book is jumpstart your future. You're Ben lamb from la MPROM
Melissa Albers 32:38
JJ Parker 32:40
NPR o n. Ben, where
Melissa Albers 32:42
can they find you? Where can they find your book
JJ Parker 32:44
on Amazon? Yeah, you'll
Ben Lampron 32:45
find my book on Amazon. If you want to contact me or send me an email. You can reach me through my website, then lamp rom com. There's a lot of information on the website.
JJ Parker 32:54
Thank you so much, Ben. Thank you,
Ben Lampron 32:55
JJ. Melissa. It's been a pleasure. Thanks. Have a great day.
Melissa Albers 33:02
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